Hey, I like the way you've structured things. It's efficient
Hope you don't mind if I borrow your technique.


------Priming------

Priming doesn't have to be an new concept or idea to the person you're asking. It's a method of framing a certain question to elicit a certain response.
I've already explained what it is, so I'm not gonna repeat myself. But hey, I'll drop it if you insist. There are bigger discussions worth having.

------'Taking it out'------

Well 2B, I don't know what to say here. I don't believe you deserved to be doxxed, for one thing.
I don't believe doxxing is a price someone should have to pay for "arrogance". Now maybe you could argue you precipitated your own doxxing somehow, but I'd never say you deserved or even earned it.
Though granted, my knowledge of that entire ordeal is fairly limited. I still would like to believe it wasn't deserved.

Also 3 months is fucking nothing, want to know what real nauseating shit is? A year and 3 months.The only reason it's an issue again is because Blu is holding a grudge propped up by paranoid delusions and Dag was doing the same thing only fueled by liquor and schizophrenia

"I don’t think it was wrong of me to assume that Alice2 would try to talk it out with them after. She’s capable. Did I expect too much?"
As you've already proven, none of them are particularly keen on talking to her.
Dag bounces back and forth depending on his anxiety, but Alice decided it best to cut him out of her life, which I can't fault her for.
Blu gave a half-assed apology and then left immediately. Before that she reached out to Alice in an Email calling her a man and generally just being an asshole.
To my knowledge, Enth and Mako blocked out communications. And the following year I saw them talking shit about Alice, calling her a cult leader. The proof of which I sent you a long while ago.



------Direct Statements-------

It's not nonsense, 2B. It's actually pretty damned important. I would in fact really like to know what other justifications they have. I assumed that you would too.
And I'd say they sure as fuck need to apologize for crossing a line that should never be crossed. But yes much like you, I don't expect it from them either.

Also that's not how this works, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim! It's not alice's or my responsibility to try to refute a 'feeling' sentiment. I need fucking statements to work with here.
And as I've previously stated, Alice hasn't exactly been in any position to talk it out with them.

------Dichotomy-------

You're absolutely right here, I conflated curiosity with boredom, that's on me.
And I absolutely believe it to be rooted in malice, given her statements before, during and after the fact:
Before: "I want to watch Alice Burn"
During: "I want to expose Alice for the man that he is"
After: "I'm not sorry."
I'm also basing this on her general personality. Again, this is an issue she brought up almost a year after the fact. She is a spiteful hateful fucking person.

-----The Screenshot------

We agree here too, she is extremely sensitive.
I think it's entirely likely Alice would have apologized to her if Blu handled the situation like an adult. For instance, messaging Alice personally and saying "Hey what you said to me earlier really hurt my feelings, can we talk about it?" Instead what happened is she let it fester inside of her, and lashed out when an opportunity presented itself.
You can't fault Alice for not being a mind reader.


------Alice2's Behavior------


I am familiar with all of those names, though a few of them are from before my time. I didn't join alice's chat until the tail end of 2011. It doesn't surprise me they've echoed the same sentiment of mistreatment though.
.I mean, you should know too. You used to run help threads.

Running help threads makes you a target, and draws in fucked up emotionally damaged people from 4chan. I know you've had experience with a doxxer, a blackbox spammer (who turned out to be nevada by the way https://i.imgur.com/YTIAzmI.png dunno if nep told you), Fenn,  and...Esdeath. Who I've heard some pretty interesting things about.
And I'm sure that's only the tip of the iceberg.

Anyway my point is, most of the people you've mentioned fit neatly into that category.

I can talk about them one by one, in fact.

------Kaen-------

A Catfish. Not a transgirl or anything like that, literally just a dude pretending to be a teen girl.
Here's a picture of him: https://i.imgur.com/24YRi5V.jpg (please try to ignore the fucking tenga and onahole on his shelf). Kaen was a bit before my time, he left around when I was just coming in, late 2011.

However I've asked Alice personally about him in the past, and just now recently to refresh my memory:
Alice entered a relationship with Kaen. He was outed as a man. He continually fucked with her, including running a doxxing campaign with Chen aimed at alice.
Then he grows a conscience, apologizes to Alice over and over again for how he treated her, and then he presumebly fucked off to some hole somewhere.

If that isn't sufficient, I asked Jan and Boss what they remembered about him https://i.imgur.com/Of4F9e0.png / https://i.imgur.com/6uEJXvt.png

I hope that's enough to safely dismiss whatever bullshit he's peddled in the past.

-----Muon-----

Muon is a bit of a curve ball for me, but from what I recall I resented Alice2 because he had some weird love obsession with Alice1.
You'd have to ask for Alice about that one.


----Mio------

Mio was yet again another catfish. Here's the picture he claimed was him: https://i.imgur.com/6q6qh8w.png (spoilers that's not actually him)
Alice and him entered in a relationship sometime around 2012/2013.
https://i.imgur.com/hzNPwYV.png
The sad irony of course was that he ended up cheating on her.
Here's some of my logs from back in the day: https://pastebin.com/LxRYSZL4

Of course there's only Alice's word to go on here, but considering those are logs from AT the time, I'd hope they'd be valid enough.

------Grey------

Grey is probably the most infamous one on here considering he's the one that started that "Alice Lied" doxxing blog.

Even before that situation came to a head, everyone always thought Gray was an insufferable smug cunt. His particular story?

He had feelings for Alice
She didn't return them
he looked into the paypal
He thought it was Alice
he lost his goddamn mind (just like Blu did.)

I mean if you ever read the old blog (before most of it got taken down for violating TOS) it's pretty obvious. I could go on ad nauseum about Grey. I have plenty of records about him. If you're interested I'd be happy to send them to you.

------Lily------

Lily is by far the most innocent person on this list. The most she's guilty of is voicing grievances about an alleged relationship she had with Alice.
Alice for the record, has denied such a relationship has ever existed, for literally as I've known her.

There also isn't any active resentment. She pops into the chat from time to time and her and Alice are very cordial with one another.
Lily also has a few mental health problems, and her perception of reality isn't always 100%. She's still a nice person though and I truly believe she means well.


-----Apology------

Thank you for apologizing.
I know I've said some shitty things to you in the past as well, so for what it's worth, I apologize for those remarks.


------- ‘Alice2 precipitated her own doxing’-------

I'd be happy to define and discuss victim blaming!
Victim blaming is a by-product of something known as the "Just World Hypothesis." It's a fallacious contention that all actions and reactions are inherently fitting consequences. I'm sure you're familiar with it; it has a lot in line with the notion of karmic justice. All good is rewarded, all evil is punished, that sort of thing. It's a justification used by perpetrators of crimes and victims of crimes and also plays a role into the bystander effect.
Some loose examples are "I'm justified in my actions because this person was weak enough to let it happen" , "I deserve this because I was alone at night" and "They probably deserved it anyway" respectively.
Basically it's the idea that people deserve what happens to them. In fact it's a pretty common reaction to crime; the idea that something bad can happen to undeserving people is a frightening prospect. It implants the idea that anyone can become a victim at any time. For the average person, It's a sort of defense mechanism. "It won't happen to me because I'm careful." This is known as Invulnerability Theory.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/26/opinion/sunday/who-blames-the-victim.html
^ Here's a good discussion of it
http://moralitylab.bc.edu/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/NiemiYoung_2016-1.pdf
^ And the actual scholarly article itself

It essentially concludes that victim blaming is a combination of failure to empathize with the victim and a fear-reaction, as I've discussed earlier.

To answer your next question, yes. indicating that a victim is partially responsible for what befell them is in fact victim blaming. It's a core component of fundamental attribution error. Personal characteristics are overemphasized while external and environmental characteristics are devalued. An example: "Alice deserved to be doxxed because of her carelessness and behavior". External factors involving the perpetrators, and the environmental characteristics involving the nature and reason of the dox are devalued proportionally.

Now I fully agree, you shouldn't leave your doors unlocked, you shouldn't wear revealing clothes alone at night, you shouldn't engage in risky behavior, etc etc etc.
It completely falls in line with what you said earlier: those are all -precipitating- a crime. But it absolutely does not mean you are -responsible- for being the victim of a crime.
And it especially doesn't mean that you deserved to have it happen to you.

The responsibility of the crime SOLELY lies on the perpetrator, regardless of how careless the victim was. The western justice systems thankfully operates on this principle.
It works in a way that doesn't hold a victim responsible for their own victimization.

After all, we don't operate on fucking sharia law.

Alice has no responsibility for her own victimization.
She didn't "deserve" it either.
The only valid statement so far in, is that she precipitated her victimization by using a paypal email linked to a personal friend of hers.
And of course, operating in a high risk area.

Beyond that, I don't believe she's done anything else to precipitate her victimization.
She's the target of people with invalid justifications, stemming from a fair and just decision she made over a year ago.

As for the last part, believe me. I've been trying to convince Alice to quit doing threads for years, citing this exact reason. /b/ is a fucked up place, full of fucked up people. I think we can agree on that front at least.


---------Concluding Remarks---------


As stated before, Alice would be 100% willing to apologize for any injustice she's inflicted on anyone.
But the thing is, she actually needs to know what that injustice is. Since those involved aren't going to give you specifics, I'm afraid I'm just going to have to conclude that whatever other justification they had for their actions is invalid. I have no doubt that they feel bitter and angry, but as we've discussed before: "Feels ain't always reals."

And on the other front, I would still like an apology from you for Alice.
By this point you've changed the phrasing and general idea of what you said in the first place by saying it was "precipitated" rather than deserved.
So I don't think it's that much more of a step just to distance yourself from the wording entirely and apologize.